UKVoIPTalk.com

Ivor Jones wrote:[color=blue]
> "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:f4pga6$2r0c$1@energise.enta.net
>
> [snip]
>[color=green]
>> You are the one whose opinion is in conflict with the
>> majority of posters to this thread. You seem to believe
>> that this newsgroup is not a forum. Others have provided
>> evidence that it is. You have provided no evidence
>> whatsoever.[/color]
>
> It is not a forum. Usenet convention says so. I am not going to repeat
> myself any more.
>
> Call it what you will, it is still not and never will be a forum.[/color]

From observing what goes on in this group for a couple of
years or so, it is clear that the the cretins who support
spam and who insist in calling a newsgroup a forum are
newbies, or so stupid that they do not know the difference
between a newsgroup and a forum. The fact that they are
happy to support spam and absorb the extra costs that spam
imposes on all users of the Internet tends to indicate that
they a completely clue resistant. Alternatively they might
be trolls who know that their behaviour will wind you up.

Either way continual responses to such cretins is a complete
waste of time.

[color=blue][color=green]
>> The burden of proof is now on you to provide something,
>> anything, to support your position.[/color]
>
> I repeat, I don't have to prove anything.[/color]

I suspect that no amount of proof you provide would stop the
cretins from disagreeing with you. For those who are clue
receptive the following links explain the difference between
a Newsgroup and a Forum.

[url]http://tinyurl.com/3bxmkq[/url]

[url]http://tinyurl.com/2t6vdy[/url]

[url]http://tinyurl.com/33dxq5[/url]
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
>>>>> Otherwise shut up.
>>> I repeat the above line.[/color]
>> Nice.[/color]
>
> I am responding in kind.
>
> Now, put up or shut up. Preferably the latter.[/color]

Sadly no matter how often you try to explain the facts, the
cretins will still claim that black is white. Perhaps it is
time that you considered ceasing to take their bait and
started consigning them to the bozo bin.

On 2007-06-14, Richard H Huelin <august2006@nospammershere.co.uk> wrote:[color=blue]
> From observing what goes on in this group for a couple of
> years or so, it is clear that the the cretins who support
> spam and who insist in calling a newsgroup a forum are
> newbies, or so stupid that they do not know the difference
> between a newsgroup and a forum. The fact that they are
> happy to support spam and absorb the extra costs that spam
> imposes on all users of the Internet tends to indicate that
> they a completely clue resistant.[/color]

Interesting that you make a link between "supporting spam" and believing
that uk.telecom.voip is a forum.

Do you personally believe that the post which started this thread was
spam? I do not, and I certainly do not support spam at all, whether it
be usenet/email/webforum/blog based or otherwise.
[color=blue]
> I suspect that no amount of proof you provide would stop the
> cretins from disagreeing with you. For those who are clue
> receptive the following links explain the difference between
> a Newsgroup and a Forum.
>
> [url]http://tinyurl.com/3bxmkq[/url][/color]

Refers to some newsgroups as forums, such as:

uk.comp.graphics.flash
Forum for UK based Macromedia Flash users
uk.net.web.authoring
A forum for UK web developers
uk.org.mensa
Forum for items of interest to UK members of Mensa
uk.org.starlink.misc
Open forum (discussion related to Astronomy)
uk.people.bodyart
A UK-focused discussion forum on body modifications
[color=blue]
> [url]http://tinyurl.com/2t6vdy[/url][/color]

Refers only to web forums, which every agrees is completely difference
to usenet anyway. We are talking about forums, not specifically
web-based forums.

"How to Understand the Difference Between Chat, Newsgroups and Web
Forums"
[color=blue]
> [url]http://tinyurl.com/33dxq5[/url][/color]

"What is the difference between a message board and a newsgroup?

The main difference is that message boards belong to a particular
website but newsgroups are the internet's open discussion forums.

I'll repeat that for you:

"newsgroups are the internet's open discussion forums".

uk.telecom.voip is a newsgroup, yes, but it is also a forum,
specifically for the discussion of VoIP in the UK.

The links you have provided to support your position do not appear to do
so?

On 2007-06-13, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:[color=blue]
> "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote:[color=green]
>> Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> Otherwise shut up.
>>>
>>> I repeat the above line.[/color]
>>
>> Nice.[/color]
>
> I am responding in kind.[/color]

How so? I've not told you to "shut up".
[color=blue]
> Now, put up or shut up. Preferably the latter.[/color]

You've now told me to shut up 3 times in 3 messages. That is just rude,
and not particularly conducive to an adult conversation.

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:slrnf72928.hq9.paul@challenger.my.home

[snip]
[color=blue]
> "newsgroups are the internet's open discussion forums".
>
> uk.telecom.voip is a newsgroup, yes, but it is also a
> forum, specifically for the discussion of VoIP in the UK.[/color]

No. It is not a forum.

I am fed up with saying it as you only seem to want to inflame the
situation.

Call it what you will, you will not change the FACT that this NEWSGROUP is
NOT a forum.

A forum can take place within a newsgroup, yes, and I suspect this is
where you are going wrong. A newsgroup is not a forum in itself.

End.


Ivor

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:slrnf7297l.hq9.paul@challenger.my.home[color=blue]
> On 2007-06-13, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:[color=green]
> > "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote:[color=darkred]
> > > Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
> > > > "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote:
> > > > > Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
> > > > > > Otherwise shut up.
> > > >
> > > > I repeat the above line.
> > >
> > > Nice.[/color]
> >
> > I am responding in kind.[/color]
>
> How so? I've not told you to "shut up".[/color]

Not in so many words, no. But your intention is clear.
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Now, put up or shut up. Preferably the latter.[/color]
>
> You've now told me to shut up 3 times in 3 messages. That
> is just rude, and not particularly conducive to an adult
> conversation.[/color]

You're not trying to have an adult conversation. An adult would not say
that a newsgroup is a forum.

Now do you want me to repeat myself yet again..?

Ivor

On 2007-06-14, Paul Cupis <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote:[color=blue]
> You've now told me to shut up 3 times in 3 messages.[/color]

Sorry, it was of course twice in two messages. The previous example was
you telling someone else to shut up.

On 2007-06-14, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:[color=blue]
> You're not trying to have an adult conversation. An adult would not say
> that a newsgroup is a forum.[/color]

Interesting. Why not? What makes uk.telecom.voip so special that it
cannot be refered to as a forum?

When you are going to provide even one example of this "convention" you
mention, or any other reference which supports your opinion?

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:slrnf72j2g.l6f.paul@challenger.my.home[color=blue]
> On 2007-06-14, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:[color=green]
> > You're not trying to have an adult conversation. An
> > adult would not say that a newsgroup is a forum.[/color]
>
> Interesting. Why not? What makes uk.telecom.voip so
> special that it cannot be refered to as a forum?[/color]

Sigh.. Because it *isn't* one.
[color=blue]
> When you are going to provide even one example of this
> "convention" you mention, or any other reference which
> supports your opinion?[/color]

It's convention. Convention isn't always written down.

In any case, I don't have to. It's a fact. If you don't want to/can't
believe it, tough. You won't change it.

I do not propose to argue with you further.

Ivor

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:slrnf72itk.l6f.paul@challenger.my.home[color=blue]
> On 2007-06-14, Paul Cupis <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote:[color=green]
> > You've now told me to shut up 3 times in 3 messages.[/color]
>
> Sorry, it was of course twice in two messages. The
> previous example was you telling someone else to shut up.[/color]

It hasn't worked though, worse luck.

I used to respect you, Paul. Now you've just shown yourself to be another
idiot like Ron Chew and all the rest.

Call this group what you like, I won't argue with you further, I'm too fed
up. But it isn't and *never will be* a forum.

End.

Ivor

In message <5dcrbtF34c6v1U1@mid.individual.net>
"Ivor Jones" <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
[color=blue]
> "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:slrnf72928.hq9.paul@challenger.my.home
>
> [snip]
>[color=green]
> > "newsgroups are the internet's open discussion forums".
> >
> > uk.telecom.voip is a newsgroup, yes, but it is also a
> > forum, specifically for the discussion of VoIP in the UK.[/color]
>
> No. It is not a forum.
>
> I am fed up with saying it as you only seem to want to inflame the
> situation.
>
> Call it what you will, you will not change the FACT that this NEWSGROUP is
> NOT a forum.[/color]

But it manifestly /is/ a forum - in the general sense of the word.
I accept that there are other entities that are called forums (and
shouldn't they be "fora"?), in the specific Internet sense of the
word; but the existence of the specific sense in no way invalidates
the general sense, therefore, since users of this newsgroup use it
as a forum for discussions, it follows that it is a forum.
[color=blue]
> A forum can take place within a newsgroup, yes, and I suspect this is
> where you are going wrong. A newsgroup is not a forum in itself.[/color]

There you go again with this logical nonsense. How can a forum
"take place"? It's as daft as saying that a street takes place.
Please explain yourself.

Dave