UKVoIPTalk.com

Ivor Jones wrote:[color=blue]
> "Dave Higton" <davehigton@dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
> news:9bda6df14e.davehigton@dsl.pipex.com[color=green]
>> In message
>>
>> <MPG.20d7158aa4280ef398aa92@text.usenet.plus.net> Jon
>> <spam@jonparker.plus.com> wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>> [email]clavox@btinternet.com[/email] declared for all the world to
>>> hear...
>>>> Once more I say this is a FORUM
>>> It is possible to be posting through a forum website,
>>> but this is very much a newsgroup.
>>>
>>> You have posted your message using a "newsreader", not
>>> a "forum-reader" X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652
>>>
>>> Also taken from your headers:
>>> Newsgroups: uk.telecom.voip
>>>
>>> Newsgroup. Not forum.[/color]
>> And therefore is a forum for discussion, in the general
>> sense of the word "forum".[/color]
>
> But not in the specific terms of Usenet definitions.[/color]

Cite? Show me a "usenet definition" which states that you cannot refer
to them as forums.

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:f4ljcv$1okf$1@energise.enta.net[color=blue]
> Ivor Jones wrote:[color=green]
> > "Jono" <nothanks@blueyonder.invalid> wrote in message
> > news:mn.5c4c7d767bc09145.48968@blueyonder.invalid[color=darkred]
> > > Ivor Jones formulated on Monday :
> > > > > A forum is a place to meet and discuss. The Forum
> > > > > in Rome is a collection of ruins but it is still
> > > > > a forum.
> > > > But this group isn't.
> > > Why can it be a "group" but not a "forum"?[/color]
> >
> > Because a newsgroup is a newsgroup, a forum is a forum.
> > It's like calling a bus a coach. They are two different
> > vehicles. They're similar, but not the same.[/color]
>
> No, calling a newsgroup a forum is like calling a bus a
> vehicle.[/color]

In your world, perhaps. Not here.

Ivor

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:f4ljen$1okf$2@energise.enta.net[color=blue]
> Ivor Jones wrote:[color=green]
> > "Dave Higton" <davehigton@dsl.pipex.com> wrote in
> > message news:9bda6df14e.davehigton@dsl.pipex.com[color=darkred]
> > > In message
> > >
> > > <MPG.20d7158aa4280ef398aa92@text.usenet.plus.net> Jon
> > > <spam@jonparker.plus.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > [email]clavox@btinternet.com[/email] declared for all the world to
> > > > hear...
> > > > > Once more I say this is a FORUM
> > > > It is possible to be posting through a forum
> > > > website, but this is very much a newsgroup.
> > > >
> > > > You have posted your message using a "newsreader",
> > > > not a "forum-reader" X-Newsreader: Forte Agent
> > > > 2.0/32.652 Also taken from your headers:
> > > > Newsgroups: uk.telecom.voip
> > > >
> > > > Newsgroup. Not forum.
> > > And therefore is a forum for discussion, in the
> > > general sense of the word "forum".[/color]
> >
> > But not in the specific terms of Usenet definitions.[/color]
>
> Cite? Show me a "usenet definition" which states that you
> cannot refer to them as forums.[/color]

I never said you can't. But if you do, you're wrong.

Ivor

Ivor Jones wrote:[color=blue]
> "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:f4ljen$1okf$2@energise.enta.net[color=green]
>> Ivor Jones wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Dave Higton" <davehigton@dsl.pipex.com> wrote in
>>> message news:9bda6df14e.davehigton@dsl.pipex.com
>>>> In message
>>>>
>>>> <MPG.20d7158aa4280ef398aa92@text.usenet.plus.net> Jon
>>>> <spam@jonparker.plus.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> [email]clavox@btinternet.com[/email] declared for all the world to
>>>>> hear...
>>>>>> Once more I say this is a FORUM
>>>>> It is possible to be posting through a forum
>>>>> website, but this is very much a newsgroup.
>>>>>
>>>>> You have posted your message using a "newsreader",
>>>>> not a "forum-reader" X-Newsreader: Forte Agent
>>>>> 2.0/32.652 Also taken from your headers:
>>>>> Newsgroups: uk.telecom.voip
>>>>>
>>>>> Newsgroup. Not forum.
>>>> And therefore is a forum for discussion, in the
>>>> general sense of the word "forum".
>>> But not in the specific terms of Usenet definitions.[/color]
>> Cite? Show me a "usenet definition" which states that you
>> cannot refer to them as forums.[/color]
>
> I never said you can't. But if you do, you're wrong.[/color]

Show me a "usenet definition" which states that you are wrong to refer
to newsgroups as forums

Ivor Jones wrote:[color=blue]
> "Desk Rabbit" <nospam@example.com> wrote in message
> news:2aqdnXkBa58x-vDbnZ2dnUVZ8qaqnZ2d@pipex.net[color=green]
>> Ivor Jones wrote:[/color]
>
> [snip]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>>>>> [url]http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/F/forum.html[/url]
>>> Ok so that says a forum can be called a newsgroup. That
>>> doesn't make it correct. It is wrong. Or do you believe
>>> everything you read on a website..?
>>>
>>>>> [url]http://www.thefreedictionary.com/forum[/url]
>>> That one doesn't even mention the word newsgroup.[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
>> Why should it?[/color]
>
> Because you're trying to tell me that a newsgroup is a forum. It isn't.
>[color=green]
>> Try reading the definition: "c. A medium
>> of open discussion or voicing of ideas, such as a newspaper or a
>> radio or television program"[/color]
>
> We're not talking about a newspaper or television programme.
>[color=green]
>> A newsgroup is a medium of open discussion i.e. its
>> neither censored nor moderated, therefore it is perfectly
>> reasonable to call a newsgroup a forum.[/color]
>
> No it isn't. It is a newsgroup.
>[color=green]
>> Now I sit back and await your carefully thought out and
>> reasoned argument which will probably be "No it isn't"[/color]
>
> True, but it isn't. Saying anything else would be incorrect.
>
> Ivor[/color]

Just saying "No it isn't" without any facts, evidence or reasoning is
not an argument. You have lost this argument hands down.

Ivor Jones wrote:[color=blue]
> "Desk Rabbit" <nospam@example.com> wrote in message
> news:6eSdnSq_ytJT-_DbnZ2dnUVZ8surnZ2d@pipex.net
>
>[color=green]
>> The UK is part of Europe therefore you are European. Just
>> saying I'm not is not a very convincing argument.[/color]
>
> Just saying I am isn't, either. The UK is part of Europe I agree but that
> doesn't automatically make me a European.
>
> In any case, I don't have to convince you either way. The truth is still
> the truth, whether you believe it or not.
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>>> Also given that Wikipedia can be edited by all and
>>> sundry, relying on it to prove a point is somewhat
>>> flaky.[/color]
>> Guess these must have also been hacked then.
>>
>> [url]http://europa.eu/abc/european_countries/index_en.htm[/url]
>> [url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3954327.stm[/url]
>> [url]http://www.coe.int/T/E/Com/About_Coe/Member_states/[/url][/color]
>
> Anything's possible, although I don't suppose they have been.
>
> I'm still not a European though.[/color]
Unfortunately you are, and if you have a passport I suspect that will
also confirm it. I've certainly not seen any Ivor only channels at
passport control.

[color=blue]
> True. That still doesn't make the OP's message not spam.[/color]
What does make it spam then?

Ivor Jones wrote:[color=blue]
> "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:f4ljcv$1okf$1@energise.enta.net[color=green]
>> Ivor Jones wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> "Jono" <nothanks@blueyonder.invalid> wrote in message
>>> news:mn.5c4c7d767bc09145.48968@blueyonder.invalid
>>>> Ivor Jones formulated on Monday :
>>>>>> A forum is a place to meet and discuss. The Forum
>>>>>> in Rome is a collection of ruins but it is still
>>>>>> a forum.
>>>>> But this group isn't.
>>>> Why can it be a "group" but not a "forum"?
>>> Because a newsgroup is a newsgroup, a forum is a forum.
>>> It's like calling a bus a coach. They are two different
>>> vehicles. They're similar, but not the same.[/color]
>> No, calling a newsgroup a forum is like calling a bus a
>> vehicle.[/color]
>
> In your world, perhaps. Not here.[/color]
A bus is a motor vehicle. A newsgroup is a forum.

On 2007-06-12, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
[color=blue]
> "Brian" <bandj@o2.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:slrnf6rptp.2tq.bandj@mymachine.invalid[color=green]
>> The 'Therefore' is spurious. It gives the impression you are drawing
>> a valid conclusion. Your premise is fallacious. No valid conclusion
>> can be drawn from an invalid premise.[/color]
>
> I *am* drawing a valid conclusion. Pity you can't see it.[/color]

You have the opportunity to help me see it later on.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> Taking that sentence (without 'Therefore') as a standalone statement
>> you appear to be saying that there is no group of people which can be
>> called European.[/color]
>
> I never said that. I said I am not one.[/color]

Your argument is:

Europe is not a country.
X was born in England.
X is English.
Therefore X is not European.

The third sentence follows from the second. The final statement does not
follow from anything written before it and replacing 'England' with
'Poland', 'Germany' etc, leads to the conclusion there are no Europeans
on the planet.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> Have we? I don't recollect. Were you as completely illogical then as
>> now?[/color]
>
> Logic isn't everything. Or is your real name Mr. Spock..?[/color]

Rational thought tends to become a bit iffy without it.

Brian.

"Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
news:f4lo2a$21bc$1@energise.enta.net

[snip]
[color=blue]
> Show me a "usenet definition" which states that you are
> wrong to refer to newsgroups as forums[/color]

I don't have to show you anything. A newsgroup is a newsgroup not a forum.

I do not propose to have this discussion ad nauseum. I suspect you are
merely attempting to wind me up. Please prove me wrong.


Ivor

"Desk Rabbit" <nospam@example.com> wrote in message
news:YZWdnZNxlsW3-_PbRVnyuwA@pipex.net[color=blue]
> Ivor Jones wrote:[color=green]
> > "Paul Cupis" <paul@cupis.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:f4ljcv$1okf$1@energise.enta.net[color=darkred]
> > > Ivor Jones wrote:
> > > > "Jono" <nothanks@blueyonder.invalid> wrote in
> > > > message
> > > > news:mn.5c4c7d767bc09145.48968@blueyonder.invalid
> > > > > Ivor Jones formulated on Monday :
> > > > > > > A forum is a place to meet and discuss. The
> > > > > > > Forum in Rome is a collection of ruins but it
> > > > > > > is still a forum.
> > > > > > But this group isn't.
> > > > > Why can it be a "group" but not a "forum"?
> > > > Because a newsgroup is a newsgroup, a forum is a
> > > > forum. It's like calling a bus a coach. They are
> > > > two different vehicles. They're similar, but not
> > > > the same.
> > > No, calling a newsgroup a forum is like calling a bus
> > > a vehicle.[/color]
> >
> > In your world, perhaps. Not here.[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> A bus is a motor vehicle.[/color]

True.
[color=blue]
>A newsgroup is a forum.[/color]

False.