UKVoIPTalk.com

"Herman" <whitehousemadhouse-2005@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in
message news:aVqkh.20580$Qa6.587@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net

[snip]
[color=blue]
> Much as I do not use Skype, because of its limited use
> for me, a user who signs up for its service HAS to accept
> all the legal T&Cs, such as:
> [url]http://www.skype.com/company/legal/eula/index.html[/url]
>
> Article 4 Utilization of Your computer
> 4.1 Utilization of Your computer. You hereby acknowledge
> that the Skype Software may utilize the processor and
> bandwidth of the computer (or other applicable device)
> You are utilizing, for the limited purpose of
> facilitating the communication between Skype Software
> users.[/color]

It says "bandwidth of the computer" - where does it say it will use part
of the bandwidth of the connection between me and my ISP..? What does
"bandwidth of the computer" mean, anyway..?
[color=blue]
> By definition, having consented to this, it is not theft.[/color]

I haven't consented.
[color=blue]
> If you consider it unfair, don't use their service.[/color]

I don't..!
[color=blue]
> Some people are happy to accept this because of
> the overall benefits to them. Market forces and all
> that...[/color]

Some people will accept anything. That doesn't make it right.


Ivor

On Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:16:03 -0000, "Ivor Jones" <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
[color=blue]
>And I'm not into letting other people steal the bandwidth *I* pay for.[/color]

WTF you on about - has the sherry damaged your brain?

On 27 Dec, 10:36, "Ivor Jones" <i...@despammed.invalid> wrote:[color=blue]
> "Herman" <whitehousemadhouse-2...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in
> messagenews:aVqkh.20580$Qa6.587@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net[/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Much as I do not use Skype, because of its limited use
> > for me, a user who signs up for its service HAS to accept
> > all the legal T&Cs, such as:
> > [url]http://www.skype.com/company/legal/eula/index.html[/url][/color]
>[color=green]
> > Article 4 Utilization of Your computer
> > 4.1 Utilization of Your computer. You hereby acknowledge
> > that the Skype Software may utilize the processor and
> > bandwidth of the computer (or other applicable device)
> > You are utilizing, for the limited purpose of
> > facilitating the communication between Skype Software
> > users.[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> It says "bandwidth of the computer" - where does it say it will use part
> of the bandwidth of the connection between me and my ISP..? What does
> "bandwidth of the computer" mean, anyway..?[/color]

Why do you have to be obstinately stupid? Let's just pretend for a
second that you can use your common sense. In the context of bandwidth
and the internet, what do you think "computer (or other applicable
device)" refers to?
[color=blue][color=green]
> > By definition, having consented to this, it is not theft.[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> I haven't consented.[/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
> > If you consider it unfair, don't use their service.[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> I don't..![/color]

So why do you persist in whinging about it?
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Some people are happy to accept this because of
> > the overall benefits to them. Market forces and all
> > that...[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> Some people will accept anything. That doesn't make it right.[/color]

Another non-sequitur.

alexd

"ale.cx" <troffasky@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1167220459.447875.310870@n51g2000cwc.googlegroups.com[color=blue]
> On 27 Dec, 10:36, "Ivor Jones" <i...@despammed.invalid>
> wrote:[/color]

[snip]
[color=blue][color=green]
> > It says "bandwidth of the computer" - where does it say
> > it will use part of the bandwidth of the connection
> > between me and my ISP..? What does "bandwidth of the
> > computer" mean, anyway..?[/color]
>
> Why do you have to be obstinately stupid? Let's just
> pretend for a second that you can use your common sense.
> In the context of bandwidth and the internet, what do you
> think "computer (or other applicable device)" refers to?[/color]

I have absolutely no idea. But it definitely isn't the bandwidth between
me and my ISP, which isn't a device of any sort. The quoted phrase is
quite definitely "bandwidth of the computer (or other applicable device)"
which means to me a physical item of equipment. How can a physical device
such as a computer have bandwidth..? The phrase has no sensible meaning.
If they had said "we will use part of the bandwidth of your ISP
connection" or something similar, then that would have made sense, but
they didn't and they don't.
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
> > > By definition, having consented to this, it is not
> > > theft.[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
> > I haven't consented.[/color]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> > > If you consider it unfair, don't use their service.[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
> > I don't..![/color]
>
> So why do you persist in whinging about it?[/color]

Because people keep on about how wonderful Skype is..!
[color=blue]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> > > Some people are happy to accept this because of
> > > the overall benefits to them. Market forces and all
> > > that...[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
> > Some people will accept anything. That doesn't make it
> > right.[/color]
>
> Another non-sequitur.[/color]

Hmm.

non sequitur n.
1.. An inference or conclusion that does not follow from the premises or
evidence.
2.. A statement that does not follow logically from what preceded it.
[Latin non sequitur, it does not follow : non, not + sequitur, third
person sing. present tense of sequi, to follow.]

I think it follows perfectly well. Just because some people accept murder
and crime as a way of life (i.e. the Mafia) doesn't make that kind of
behaviour right.

Ivor





[color=blue]
>
> alexd[/color]

"Tom Thumb" <nobody@devnull.spamcop.net> wrote in message
news:8im4p25em2k0tqib1haf9cthdj7ordagnu@4ax.com[color=blue]
> On Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:16:03 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
> <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
>[color=green]
> > And I'm not into letting other people steal the
> > bandwidth *I* pay for.[/color]
>
> WTF you on about - has the sherry damaged your brain?[/color]

I've already explained it several times, my brain obviously isn't the only
damaged one.

Ivor

PS don't drink sherry, can't stand the stuff. Now a decent pint of real
ale, that's something different :-)

On 2006-12-27, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
[color=blue]
> "ale.cx" <troffasky@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1167220459.447875.310870@n51g2000cwc.googlegroups.com[color=green]
>> On 27 Dec, 10:36, "Ivor Jones" <i...@despammed.invalid> wrote:[/color]
>
> [snip]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>> > It says "bandwidth of the computer" - where does it say it will use
>> > part of the bandwidth of the connection between me and my ISP..?
>> > What does "bandwidth of the computer" mean, anyway..?[/color]
>>
>> Why do you have to be obstinately stupid? Let's just pretend for a
>> second that you can use your common sense. In the context of
>> bandwidth and the internet, what do you think "computer (or other
>> applicable device)" refers to?[/color]
>
> I have absolutely no idea. But it definitely isn't the bandwidth
> between me and my ISP, which isn't a device of any sort. The quoted
> phrase is quite definitely "bandwidth of the computer (or other
> applicable device)" which means to me a physical item of equipment.
> How can a physical device such as a computer have bandwidth..? The
> phrase has no sensible meaning. If they had said "we will use part of
> the bandwidth of your ISP connection" or something similar, then that
> would have made sense, but they didn't and they don't.[/color]

You started off digging with a shovel. Now you have progressed to a TBM.
You are rapidly approaching the centre of the Earth.

There is plenty of the material at Skype's website which indicates that
Skype utilises the bandwidth of an internet connection. By using the
progam you agree to facilitate 'the communication between Skype Software
users' and that takes bandwith (telepathy is unreliable). Stealing?
Hardly.
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
>> > > Some people are happy to accept this because of the overall
>> > > benefits to them. Market forces and all that...[/color]
>>[color=darkred]
>> > Some people will accept anything. That doesn't make it right.[/color]
>>
>> Another non-sequitur.[/color][/color]

[Definitions snipped]
[color=blue]
> I think it follows perfectly well. Just because some people accept
> murder and crime as a way of life (i.e. the Mafia) doesn't make that
> kind of behaviour right.[/color]

Steady on! One of those behaviours is neither illegal or immoral. Let's
have no category confusion in this group.

Brian.

"Brian" <bandj@o2.co.uk> wrote in message
news:emv423$1f7$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk[color=blue]
> On 2006-12-27, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
>[color=green]
> > "ale.cx" <troffasky@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1167220459.447875.310870@n51g2000cwc.googlegroups.com[color=darkred]
> > > On 27 Dec, 10:36, "Ivor Jones"
> > > <i...@despammed.invalid> wrote:[/color]
> >
> > [snip]
> >[color=darkred]
> > > > It says "bandwidth of the computer" - where does it
> > > > say it will use part of the bandwidth of the
> > > > connection between me and my ISP..? What does
> > > > "bandwidth of the computer" mean, anyway..?
> > >
> > > Why do you have to be obstinately stupid? Let's just
> > > pretend for a second that you can use your common
> > > sense. In the context of bandwidth and the internet,
> > > what do you think "computer (or other applicable
> > > device)" refers to?[/color]
> >
> > I have absolutely no idea. But it definitely isn't the
> > bandwidth between me and my ISP, which isn't a device
> > of any sort. The quoted phrase is quite definitely
> > "bandwidth of the computer (or other applicable
> > device)" which means to me a physical item of
> > equipment. How can a physical device such as a computer
> > have bandwidth..? The phrase has no sensible meaning.
> > If they had said "we will use part of the bandwidth of
> > your ISP connection" or something similar, then that
> > would have made sense, but they didn't and they don't.[/color]
>
> You started off digging with a shovel. Now you have
> progressed to a TBM. You are rapidly approaching the
> centre of the Earth.[/color]

Really..?
[color=blue]
> There is plenty of the material at Skype's website which
> indicates that Skype utilises the bandwidth of an
> internet connection.[/color]

Where did I mention Skype's website..? I have never been there. I am
merely quoting the reference posted here, which clearly states the exact
words "bandwidth of the computer (or other applicable device)"
[color=blue]
> By using the progam you agree to
> facilitate 'the communication between Skype Software
> users' and that takes bandwith (telepathy is unreliable).[/color]

Possibly, I have no direct experience of it.
[color=blue]
> Stealing? Hardly.[/color]

If it is done without the knowledge of the person concerned, then it is
stealing.
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
> > > > > Some people are happy to accept this because of
> > > > > the overall benefits to them. Market forces and
> > > > > all that...
> > >
> > > > Some people will accept anything. That doesn't make
> > > > it right.
> > >
> > > Another non-sequitur.[/color][/color]
>
> [Definitions snipped]
>[color=green]
> > I think it follows perfectly well. Just because some
> > people accept murder and crime as a way of life (i.e.
> > the Mafia) doesn't make that kind of behaviour right.[/color]
>
> Steady on! One of those behaviours is neither illegal or
> immoral. Let's have no category confusion in this group.[/color]

Which one..?

Ivor

On Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:08:37 -0000, "Ivor Jones" <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:

[color=blue]
>"Brian" <bandj@o2.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:emv423$1f7$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk[/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
>> You started off digging with a shovel. Now you have
>> progressed to a TBM. You are rapidly approaching the
>> centre of the Earth.[/color]
>
>Really..?[/color]

You're making yourself look more of a prat with each new post in this thread.

"Tom Thumb" <nobody@devnull.spamcop.net> wrote in message
news:h5u6p29abbnliirm9u007ndh8klqrcfeag@4ax.com[color=blue]
> On Thu, 28 Dec 2006 01:08:37 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
> <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
>
>[color=green]
> > "Brian" <bandj@o2.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:emv423$1f7$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk[/color]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> > > You started off digging with a shovel. Now you have
> > > progressed to a TBM. You are rapidly approaching the
> > > centre of the Earth.[/color]
> >
> > Really..?[/color]
>
> You're making yourself look more of a prat with each new
> post in this thread.[/color]

Really..? Oh dear I'm so worried. At least nobody is stealing my
bandwidth.


Ivor

On 2006-12-28, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
[color=blue]
> "Brian" <bandj@o2.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:emv423$1f7$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk[color=green]
>> On 2006-12-27, Ivor Jones <ivor@despammed.invalid> wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>> > I think it follows perfectly well. Just because some people accept
>> > murder and crime as a way of life (i.e. the Mafia) doesn't make
>> > that kind of behaviour right.[/color]
>>
>> Steady on! One of those behaviours is neither illegal or immoral.
>> Let's have no category confusion in this group.[/color]
>
> Which one..?[/color]

Choose one. It doesn't matter which; the flaw in your logic remains.

Brian.